Atheist claim: you can't be omniscient for all possibilities ( like materialism & strong atheism) to be ruled out per see.
Response: That's correct. But we can hold to the most reasonable position based on the current knowledge and understanding of science, philosophy, and theology until new, eventually more accurate information becomes available and then adapt our position. As it comes out, materialism is not something that we have not figured out yet. The range of creative power of alternative mechanisms to intelligence is known. It does not exist. It is nil and can be entirely neglected. Chance is impotent. Were there not stubborn, insistent, and obstinate materialists, full of wishful and hopeful thinking, attempting to give material causes credence and equip them with divine attributes like all powerfulness, atheism as a philosophical worldview would not exist. Atheism is just silly, and rational suicide. Atheism is only still alive because people have an emotional commitment to it for several motivations. None of them have ANYTHING to do with reason, rational thought following the evidence, or even science. Strong atheism is a metaphysical belief system with no evidence that backs it up. NONE. Nada. Zilch. It constantly shifts the burden of proof to theists but tries to be absent from providing anything. In the last ten years or so, it evolved from the claim that "Most probably there is no God" - and when it was realized that the attempts to back up the claim every time failed miserably, they moved to the more "modern" version: "We are just skeptic of your God claim" attempting to exempt themselves to back up their story. There is basically NOTHING that it explains adequately. But atheists have erected their cardhouse to the sublime Olymp of reason and rationality (sic.)
Atheists protest against something they say that there is no evidence for. They have an itch they can’t scratch and it’s driving them crazy. They think the only salve to their itch is to convince others of what they themselves are not certain of. They are desperate to destroy others thinking that is the path to their salvation. Why should a theist know about your willingly chosen incredulity & ignorance? Do you also wear t-shirts where you inform everyone that you don't believe in Pink Unicorns and Aliens? Is your internet-atheology-misotheology-activism & militancy not an entirely senseless foolish, and meaningless endeavor? Unless you have a positive case with positive evidence that supposedly rationally and logically points to materialism as having more and *better* explanatory power than theism, that in your view TOPS theism, why do you waste your time arguing with happy theists, that are satisfied with the explanation they have found, and so, peace in their heart, the forgiveness of their sins, and hope for eternal life? Why are you attempting to drag believers in God down to your misery, cognitive dissonance, hopelessness, agnosticism, and nihilism? Guess what?? Theists could not care less about the atheist's spiritual void and misery. Atheism has nothing to offer to an intellectually satisfied theist and Christian.
The best an agnostic or weak atheist could do is stay silent and just keep his unbelief for himself. Why make a fuss over an idea that has no sense for you? There are untold multitudes who have no interest in waging war on beliefs that mean nothing to them. Atheism has nothing positive to contribute to anyone. It does not improve the lives in any way. It has no doctrine nor provides a guide for moral improvement. In many cases, it is a declaration of ignorance. Why many urges to proclaim to others what they do not believe is beyond me...
If the atheist's last answer to origins is: " I don't know" - why do they engage theists, to eagerly express their freely chosen ignorance and emptiness and void of meaning in their lifes? Do they think they will convince theists somehow, that ignorance is bliss? Do they think, ignorance exercises some kind of positive force or influence or attraction to someone's life? - and for that reason, we shall know it? Not only that but as it seems, they believe theists base their views on gaps in understanding, despite the fact, that over and over it is demonstrated to them, that this is not the case ?! I cannot imagine of a more senseless endeavor, than weak atheists that have nothing else to offer and to do, then engage theists, to do nothing else than express their ignorance. Its as if a homeless, jobless begging hungry vagrant sits on the corner on a street, and sees a successful happy fulfilled person passing by, and trying to convince that person that his state of affairs is attractive and better than anyone else's one..... Go figure.
Atheists commonly confess ignorance and base it on the claim that there is no evidence of God. The consequence of such a position is:
the lack of
objective moral values
meaning of life
lack of recognition of the real intrinsic value of human beings
what really matters in life ( to love God, and your next )
and become a playball of their own
certainty of anything
lack of goals in life
lack of direction in life
the consequences are:
Increase of crimes
destructuration of families
false doctrines and various isms which undermine the value of life, like
Atheism is an idea that doesn’t matter. It leads to no good, it helps no one and it tends to either universal anarchy and chaos or totalitarian despotism, and the ultimate fate and consequence is to die and be judged upon their own sins and mistakes and paying for their sins and rejection of God in Hell forever and ever.
If a person doesn’t think there is a God to be accountable to, then—then what's the point of trying to modify your behavior to keep it within acceptable ranges?,” "That's how I thought anyway. I always believed the theory of evolution as truth, that we all just came from the slime. When we, when we died, you know, that was it, there is nothing.”
The historical fact is that outright rejection of God and institutionalizing of atheism actually does produce evil on incredible levels. We're talking about tens of millions of people as a result of the rejection of God.”
the list below illustrates the human carnage that results from Godless regimes;
The French Jacobins
Stalin's Soviet Russia
Hitler's Nazi Germany
Mao Zedong's China
Pol Pot's Cambodia
Mubutu Seko's Zaire
Idi Amin's Uganda
The 1994 Rwandan genocides
Kim Jong-un's North Korea
Atheism is cancer no matter how you try and sugar coat it. The only manifestation of atheism in state power is totalitarianism. No exceptions. For two centuries-- from 1789-- every atheist philosophy that has risen to power has brought hell to earth among the people under its boot. Atheist 'secular humanism' has one salient characteristic-- it never survives the rise of atheism. What begins with an edited Jefferson always ends with a pockmarked Caligula. Atheism in power has always been totalitarian.
Atheist rank the highest in 4 stats, suicide, depression, medication intake, and school shootings. If that is not FAIL, I do not know what is...
According to the 2003 World Health Organization's report on international male suicides rates (which compared 100 countries), of the TOP TEN nations with the highest male suicide rates, all but one (Sri Lanka) are strongly irreligious nations with high levels of atheism. Of the BOTTOM TEN nations with the lowest male suicide rates, all are highly religious nations with statistically insignificant levels of organic atheism. Atheist are a small minority world wide, so the fact that they even make the charts on suicide rate just goes to show you how crazy it is. Japan has always been an atheist country, wealthy and prosperous as well. Yet, they have always ranked either #1 or #2 on Earth for highest suicide rates. Last year in Japan, more than 25,000 people took their own lives. That's 70 every day.
Do you want me to list every single mass school shooter and post their religious beliefs, I mean “lack thereof” because I can. Religious Affiliation, Atheism, and Suicide According to a recent study published in The American Journal of Psychiatry religious affiliation is associated with significantly lower levels of suicide compared to religiously unaffiliated people, atheists, and agnostics. Source: Kanita Dervic, Maria A. Oquendo, Michael F. Grunebaum, Steve Ellis, Ainsley K. Burke, and J. John Mann. "Religious Affiliation and Suicide Attempt" (161:2303-2308, December 2004).
We Christians are often called out and accused of trying to convert non-believers or adherents of other faith systems to Christianity, force them into something they don't want, and not respect them. They do however not understand, that we have a command by the Lord Jesus Christ: to spread the clear teachings of Jesus and the Apostles of the Gospel (Good News) with love and kindness, and make disciples. To preach the gospel is one thing. A true religion/worldview is spread by using evidence and logical arguments, discussion and fair debates, allowing people to make up their minds and exercise their free choice to accept or reject the beliefs.
Usually, when debating atheists, I do not start with apologetics, with the attempt to defend my Christian faith. I start demonstrating why theism makes more sense than atheism. Why intelligent design tops explanatory power compared to philosophical naturalism. When this step has been clarified, I go ahead with a cumulative argument, that leads to the Christian faith.
We are not asked to interfere in the decision making of the receiver of our message. We are called to make the gospel of God's grace, love, justice, forgiveness, and eternal life known. If someone by deliberate decision wants to become a Christian, then we are called to instruct the new convert in his new faith. The Christian has good reasons to confess his faith, first, to obey the Lord's command, and secondly, to give others the opportunity to find salvation and eternal life.
What makes people reject God is not the ( lack of ) scientific evidence, but sin. They love darkness more than the light.
In many places, atheists express actively their non-belief in God. They most commonly criticize the bible as a book of fables and magic, not trustworthy. But why is that? First of all, the rationale for this thinking is logically fallacious. The bible is false, therefore, (strong) atheism is true. That is an affirmative conclusion from a negative premise. The illicit negative occurs when a categorical syllogism has a positive conclusion, but one or two negative premises. The proponents of strong atheism/naturalism, however, must be able to present and adopt a well-articulated, thorough-going positive reason and the evidence-based case using positive evidence that results in good justifications to infer naturalism or strong atheism. What the debater must present, is a positive case for strong atheism by reference to the evidence that favors an atheistic interpretation of reality. But why do so many actively pursue this endeavor with the fervor of a believer, to express their unbelief? What do active strong militant atheists try to achieve? Check and see any description of a Facebook group of atheism, what the goal of the group is, and you will not find a clear confession and delineation of goals. Question: Why are you not an A-UfOlogist ? or A-spiritist? Why do so many spend so much energy, time, dedication to express what they do NOT believe?
What is the goal of the active atheist? The outcome of atheism is that there are no real binding moral values and duties. There can't be if God does not exist. Do whatever pleases you and what you want becomes the compass of actions. Get rid of God, and you do not need to fear God, nor that there will be a judgment day, nor eternal punishment, nor hell. This seems to me to be the deepest desire of atheists. Get rid of God. He shall not exist. But why proselytize and try to convince others of this perspective and view of reality? Do atheists by doing this try to convince themselves that their worldview must be true? The more they repeat it, the more they believe it themself, and the more comfortable they get? It seems to me, that is one of the views of possible reasons. But is it really? Can our existence without God existing be comfortable? I think, it can't, but it will lead, if thought all through, to desperation and nihilism.
The British philosopher Bertrand Russell, for example, believed that we have no choice but to build our lives upon “the firm foundation of unyielding despair.” Only by recognizing that the world really is a terrible place can we successfully come to terms with life. Camus said that we should honestly recognize life’s absurdity and then live in love for one another. Frankly speaking, atheism is boring, but knowing, enjoying, and serving God gives life purpose and excitement. If the atheist’s worldview is correct, then we are nothing but the result of accidental chemical processes and our thoughts are merely chemical reactions that take place in our brain. Therefore, nothing you ever do, or say, or even believe matters. In the end, we all go back to “star dust.” So, why argue? Why waste your time talking to someone about the truth or falsehood of something when it doesn’t matter in the end? On what basis does human life have value? As Francis Schaeffer wrote: Modern man resides in a two-story universe. In the lower story is the finite world without God; here life is absurd, as we have seen. In the upper story are meaning, value, and purpose. Now modern man lives in the lower story because he believes there is no God. But he cannot live happily in such an absurd world; therefore, he continually makes leaps of faith into the upper story to affirm meaning, value, and purpose, even though he has no right to, since he does not believe in God. Modern man is totally inconsistent when he makes this leap, because these values cannot exist without God, and man in his lower story does not have God. It’s impossible to live consistently and happily within the framework of such a worldview. If you live consistently, you will not be happy; if you live happily, it is only because you are not consistent. But as a theist, i believe i was created in God's image, and therefore i am of great value.
Atheists use commonly two weights and two measures: They self-declare themselves ( not rarely ) as skeptics, free- THINKERS, on the rational side, and the "owners" of logic, but most often they endorse a passive position in regards to atheism, and a hypercritical one in regard of theism, and in special in regard to the Bible. Rather than scrutinizing both worldviews - theism, and atheism, they neglect to analyze the consistency of strong atheism ( most probably there is no God) but put a BIG eye to find holes in the views of theists. They remain skeptical of God and certain that most probably there is no God.They also hide by arguing that they do not defend any positive claim, namely that most probably there are no Gods, but all they do is doubt of the claims of theists ( and think, that way they can avoid the burden of proof ). If that was so, what an empty and senseless endeavor - are they also actively spending time in various FB groups and other places, promoting their disbelief in ET's, UFO's, FSM's, ghosts, a flat earth, a square moon etc. ? they are not true skeptics and honest seekers of the truth of origins, but fakers that only delude themselves, and the active ones try to drag others down to their ignorance in an attempt to find relief of their doubts.
Atheists constantly ask for empirical proofs of Gods existence. They say: No one has ever produced any verifiable evidence for any god. All the religions make that claim for their specific god. Well, I want some proof, hard verifiable proof.
Have you already heard that demand? I hear it constantly. Then you begin with Jesus, with the fulfilled prophecies, with design in nature, with the Kalaam, fine-tuning of the universe, the complexity of living beings, the origin of life and so on.....
When you already did spend a deal of time, and no progress was made, you ask: What evidence are you looking for? usually, the atheist has no answer, because he never thought about that question. He does not know how to recognize Gods signature in nature. But that also demonstrates that he had never a real intention to find God. Usually, most atheists we encounter, just want to confirm what they already believe, and are not open or interested to encounter Jesus.
They see no benefit in their lives to believe in God, want to keep living autonomously from him and diminish the fear that HE eventually does exist and might punish and condemn them for their sins. So they are grateful when they find a not so well instructed theist, where they can bash his faith in old debunked fairy tale books written by sheepherders, and so on. When they find a theist which refutes their lame excuses with qualification, they get angry, and name-calling begins.
But when they demand verifiable evidence, they mean that they want a theophany, where God does magic in front of them, or an appearance on the Sky, where he hand-waves: Hi friend, I am heeere !!
An atheist in most cases has no idea how Gods existence would be proven. Another escape is: " God knows what it takes to convince me of his existence".
But usually, what is meant, even if not expressed is: They want some sensory input, they want to sense God.
Socrates said: Say, that I may see you!
Spoken words say who you are. Jesus said:
For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words, you will be condemned.”
Words say who you are.
Words say who God is. Information is the key. A meme which is quite insulting says: " I need people to prove God to me because I cannot think for myself."
Well, the truth is, God speaks to us through his word, because that is the right and best method of revelation. Spoken words, Information. Of course, if an atheist rejects Gods revelation through his spoken word outhand and a priori, then the problem is not the lack of Gods revelation. But his incredulity and misotheism.
Gods message was revealed to humankind through history that he made with Israel in the Old Testament, during an increasing taking off the veil, a gradual revelation of his nature through HIS interaction with Israel, which had its epitome when God made his appearance in Christ, and the curtain of the holy of the holy of the second temple was torn in two from top to bottom. That meant, men now had direct spiritual access to the throne of God through the holy spirit and prayer - no priest intermediate required.
The age of grace makes it possible to man through the holy spirit to come into the close presence of God, into the intimate union and spiritual interaction. God has made it possible. Now it depends on us, to develop this relationship. Gods word exhorts us to exert our faith, and the more we do, the more we will experience God in our lives.
As the Bible says: There is no justification for unbelief. God could have remained hidden and not revealed his identity - but he did. He has revealed his power in his creation, so: no excuse. The claim that there is no evidence of HIM is lame, inexcusable, willfully ignorant, and unless the unbeliever repents, Gods response will be just and in time.
Atheists have a lamentable tendency to think they are rationally superior to believers in God.
Just by becoming atheists, atheists think they are rationally superior and more qualified to opine on issues related to religion and origins. Worse, this attitude often comes with an arrogant certainty that they have no need to listen or learn from people who've actually considered and studied all possible worldviews, and concluded that theism is the most case-adequate explanation of our existence.
Selfishness and pride
This comes together with an attitude of selfishness and pride. Pride is attempting to displace God with self or living as if we were the highest instance of reality, nobody above us, and no God. Both lead to apostasy from God. Selfishness is preferring one's own ideas as opposed to God's truth and revelation. It is an implicit and logical consequence and constitutes the antithesis to love God, and our next, and as a fundamental and positive choice of preference of self instead of God and our neighbor. Egoism and selfishness are on the opposite end of loving God, and loving our neighbor. Selfishness is expressed as the preference of exaltation of self, used to oppose anything that expresses God's existence and his virtues. It is the key explaining nearly and perhaps all sin. Selfishness expresses itself in many different forms. Sensual, lustful, inordinate, appetites, such as avarice, ambition, vanity, pride, covetousness, idolatry, unbelief, rebellion, lawbreaking, and pride all expressions of selfishness.
Atheism is an expression of rebellion and disobedience against God. All people possess volition, which can be exercised either in obedience or disobedience. We see the New Atheists direct their rebellion against the revelation of God in creation, conscience, law, and ultimately the person of Jesus Christ. There are many examples as the Israelites “stiff-necked” and were “stubborn” people who committed a “great sin,” thereby rebelling against the LORD (Deut. 9:6–21). The Apostle Peter warned his readers not to rebel as did those who lived during the time of Noah and fell under God’s wrath in the flood (1 Pet. 3:20)
The sin of unbelief is a major theme in the Gospel of John. “Those who do not believe are condemned already, because they have not believed in the name of the only Son of God” (John 3:18). Jesus equated unbelief with disobedience (John 12:48) and described unbelief as blindness (John 9:39). Unbelief and disobedience are so intertwined that some theologians define sin as “unbelieving-disobedience” or “disobeying-in-unbelief. Unbelief in the New Testament is depicted as: blasphemy against the Holy Spirit (Matt. 12:22–32); an evil, unbelieving heart (Heb. 3:12); deliberate sinning after the reception of the knowledge of truth (Heb. 10:26–29); and the “sin leading to death” (1 John 5:16). Unbelief includes the rejection of the general revelation of God within creation and conscience (Rom. 1:18–23; 2:14–15). The rejection of Jesus Christ as the Son of God, the revealer and Redeemer, is the quintessential denial of the light and truth of God.
Last edited by Otangelo on Fri Mar 19, 2021 7:37 am; edited 42 times in total