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Defending the Christian Worldview, Creationism, and Intelligent Design » Bible / Christian faith / Apologetics » Islam is incoherent

Islam is incoherent

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1Islam is incoherent Empty Islam is incoherent Sun Dec 28, 2014 1:54 pm

Otangelo


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Islam is incoherent

https://reasonandscience.catsboard.com/t1910-islam-is-incoherent

Darth Dawkins in conversation with a muslim
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVkXfeim7Ho&t=1871s


Islam’s View of Man’s Sinful Nature and the Christian Response
Like the Bible, the Quran teaches that people are descendants of Adam and Eve and are imperfect sinners. However, the Quran also teaches that their god, Allah, inspired sin in humankind (Quran 4:88; 7:16–18; 9:51; 14:4; 16:93; 35:8; 57:22; 74:31; 91:7–9). Muslims believe that humans are sinners because Allah has willed it. They have no understanding similar to the Bible’s teaching that humans, not God, caused sin through rebellion against God (Romans 5:12, 5:18–19).

Islam’s View of Salvation and the Christian Response
The Quran’s teachings regarding salvation are inconsistent. On the one hand, the Quran teaches that salvation is based on purification by good deeds (Quran 7:6–9). A Muslim can become righteous through prayer, almsgiving, fasting, and living according to the Quran. Yet the Quran also teaches that Allah has predetermined every person’s destiny, and one’s righteous acts may or may not affect Allah’s decision (Quran 57:22). It teaches that everyone, both the righteous and the unrighteous, will be led into hell by Allah, before the righteous will enter heaven (Quran 19:67–72). Therefore no Muslim can know his or her eternal destiny in this life. Even Muhammad himself was unsure of his salvation (Quran 31:34; 46:9).

Today, whenever Muslims mention the name of Muhammad, they always add the phrase, “Peace be upon him,” because Muhammad’s eternal destiny is uncertain, and the Muslim must ask Allah to be merciful to him. This contradiction between the Quran’s teaching of salvation by works and its teaching of Allah determining salvation, regardless of one’s works, results in Islam being the world’s most uncertain religion regarding salvation

We, as Christians, on the other hand, can be assured of our salvation: John 5:24 “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.
Romans 5:21 so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
The Bible tells us that not all will enter hell. Only Satan, the demons, and the unsaved will enter hell
Revelation 20:15: Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire..


The Crucifixion in the Quran
Here’s a summary about what the Quran has to say about the crucifixion of Jesus:

Jesus wasn’t killed
Jesus wasn’t crucified
People were mistaken to think they killed/crucified Jesus
Allah raised up Jesus to be with him in heaven
https://ihopeministries.org/muslims-reject-crucifixion/

Sam ShamounThe Crucifixion of Christ - A Christian Critique of the Quran
If it can be proven that Jesus did not die and rise from the dead, then Christianity is nothing more than a great lie which has deceived literally billions throughout the ages. The Christian is left without hope, having no assurance of justification, and remains in his sins. (Cf. 1 Corinthians 15:12-19; Romans 4:25, 5:8-11) In spite of the Quranic affirmation that Jesus was not crucified or killed there is no substantiation within the Quran itself that someone else, namely Judas, died in the place of Christ. All the text says is that it was made to appear as if Christ had been crucified. How this was done remains unanswered.

The idea that Jesus did not die on the cross stems from the Quran in S. 4:157-158:

Sahih International
And [for] their saying, "Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, the messenger of Allah ." And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but [another] was made to resemble him to them. And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about it. They have no knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not kill him, for certain.
https://legacy.quran.com/4/157-158
https://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/crucifixion.htm

Gregory R. Lanier “It Was Made to Appear Like that to Them:” Islam’s Denial of Jesus’ Crucifixion
Of the major theological divides that separate Islam and Christianity, one of the most difficult to pin down is the denial of the crucifixion of Jesus in Muslim tradition. Though the assertion that Jesus did not die on the cross appears in only part of one difficult verse in the Qur’an (Q4:157, see below), scholars agree that the majority view within Islam is that this verse “affirms categorically that Christ did not die on the cross and that God raised him to Godself.” In fact, the rejection of the crucifixion has presented a significant challenge for Muslim-Christian engagement.

This dogma is not, however, without its difficulties: it requires rejection of the broad scholarly consensus that the crucifixion of Jesus of Nazareth outside Jerusalem under the oversight of Pontius Pilate is an indisputable historical fact; it strains exegesis of other parts of the Qur’an and appears to rely on strained exegesis of one verse; and it has spawned a wide range of often speculative and contradictory explanations. But does the Qur’an itself actually deny the resurrection?  By analyzing the textual data and interpretive history, it will be argued that the belief that Jesus was not crucified actually stems from an anti-Jewish polemical passage that was misinterpreted along both Shi’a and Sunni lines and cemented by medieval orthodoxy. In other words, it is not the Qur’an itself that indisputably denies the crucifixion, but the scholars defending Islamic orthodoxy.

The most common interpretation, often called the “substitution theory,” takes the implied object of the verb to be Jesus himself: namely, it was not Jesus who was crucified, but someone who “appeared” like him to the Jews and was killed in his place (e.g., the Sahih International rendering). This theory maintains that the Jews intended to crucify Jesus, and a historical crucifixion indeed happened, but Allah controverted the Jews by placing Jesus’ visage on another person who, subsequently, took his place on the cross. Islamic exegetes have generated a plethora of possible identities of the person who bore Jesus’ image and replaced him on the cross: a passing Jew, a Roman soldier, Judas Iscariot, Simon of Cyrene, or one of the apostles such as Tatanus, Sergius, or Peter.[18] In short, the substitutionist reading, which is the most popular among Muslims today, is “that someone was, in fact, crucified, but it was not Jesus.”

Islamic Conception of Salvation
A third approach locates Islam’s trenchant denial of the crucifixion in its attempt at “undermining the construct of redemption.” On this view, by calling into question whether Jesus actually died on the cross at all, Islamic scholars have severed the link between the crucifixion and the redemptive importance assigned to it by Christianity. Given the Qur’an’s denial of Jesus’ divinity as well as its generally negative stance towards the biblical idea of human depravity or original sin, Islam does not teach a concept of atonement, which is obviously tied up in the event of the cross for Christians. Thus, not only is the crucifixion of a Messenger of Allah (even a special one like Jesus) soteriologically unnecessary in Islam, it would actually contradict the general teaching of Islam regarding the nature of salvation; “since Islam has no such doctrine [of redemption], such a death never would take place.” In other words, the denial of the crucifixion is a kind of doctrinal Occam’s Razor: it serves no purpose, so it is rejected. Though it is generally the most compelling option, the problem facing this explanatory framework is that it assumes the Qur’an has soteriology in view in 4:157, which may not, in fact, be the case.
https://journal.rts.edu/article/it-was-made-to-appear-like-that-to-them-islams-denial-of-jesus-crucifixion-in-the-quran-and-dogmatic-tradition/

Blueletterbible Salvation, as Islam Understands It, Is Based upon a Person’s Good Works Outweighing Their Bad

Claim: (Surah 23:102-104).
They whose balances shall be heavy shall be blest. But they whose balances shall be light, they shall lose their soul, abiding in hell forever.
In Islam, people are saved by the will of Allah through obedience to his law, the Shari’ah. Consequently, in Islam, a person is to live a good life, pleasing God in all that they do. They are to submit to him and follow his commandments. Religion, to the Muslim, does not mean salvation from sin. Instead, it means following the right path, or the Shariah which mapped out by Islamic law. Salvation in Islam is not understood in the same way as salvation in Christianity.  And anyone who holds to the doctrine of the Trinity commits the unpardonable sin.

Reply: (Isaiah 64:6 NIV) All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away.

(Titus 3:5 NLT) He saved us, not because of the good things we did, but because of his mercy. He washed away our sins and gave us a new life through the Holy Spirit
(John 8:24 NRSV) “I told you that you would die in your sins, for you will die in your sins unless you believe that I am he.”
(John 3:36 NASB) “He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
(1 John 5:12, 13 NLT) So whoever has God’s Son has life; whoever does not have his Son does not have life. I write this to you who believe in the Son of God, so that you may know you have eternal life.

There Is No Assurance of Salvation in This Life
Islam cannot offer anyone assurance of salvation in this life. It is only at the Judgment Day that people will discover whether they have been accepted by Allah. This of course, means that nobody can have any real security in this life as to where they will be in the next.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/stewart_don/faq/islam/13-how-does-a-person-achieve-salvation-in-islam.cfm

Every religion besides Christianity teaches us to earn our way to God.
Christianity is the only religion that teaches that God came to us. Romans 5:8 says, “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”

Other religions have systems of rules to appease their god. Christianity is a relationship with God.
https://newspring.cc/articles/3-ways-christianity-is-different-from-other-religions

Jesus vs Muhammed
https://reasonandscience.catsboard.com/t1910-islam-is-a-lie#3213

Better stay alone than to follow Mohammed.
• Muhammad said: Allah hates those who don’t accept Islam. (Qur’an 30:4, 3:32, 22:38)  ​Jesus said: God loves everyone. (John  3:16)
• Muhammad said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. (Muslim 1:33)  Jesus said: He who lives by the sword will die by the sword. (Matthew 26:52)
• Muhammad stoned women for adultery. (Sahih Muslim 4206) •Jesus said: Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. (John 8:7)
• uhammad permitted stealing from unbelievers (Bukhan 44:668, Ibn Ishaq 764) • Jesus said: Thou shalt not steal (Matthew 19:18)
• Muhammad permitted lying (Sahih Muslim 6303, Bukhari 49:857) • Jesus said: Thou shalt not bear false witness. (Matthew 19:18)
• Muhammad owned and traded slaves (Sahih Muslim 3901) • Jesus neither owned nor traded slaves.
• Muhammad murdered those who insulted him. (Bukhari 56:369, 4:241) • Jesus preached forgiveness and forgave those who killed Him. (Luke 23:34)
• Muhammad said: If then anyone transgresses the prohibition against you, transgress ye likewise against him. (Qur’an 2:194) • Jesus said: If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. (Matthew 5:39)
• Muhammad said: Jihad in the way of Allah elevates one’s position in Paradise by a hundred fold. (Muslim 4645) • Jesus said: Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. (Matthew 5:9)
• Muhammad married 13 wives and kept sex slaves. (Bukhari 5:268, Qur’an 33:50) • Jesus was celibate, was never married.
• Muhammad had sex with a 9 year old child. (Sahih Muslim 3309, Bukhari 58:236) • Jesus did not have sex with children.
• Muhammad ordered the murder of women. (Ibn Ishaq 819, 995) • Jesus never harmed a woman, He loved and cared for them.
• Muhammad said: O you who believe! Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness. (Qur’an 3:110) • Jesus said: Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the Earth. (Matthew 5:5)
• Muhammad ordered 65 military campaigns and raids in his last 10 years. (Ibn Ishaq) • Jesus ordered no military campaigns, nor offered any approval of war or violence.
• Muhammad killed captives taken in battle. (Ibn Ishaq 451) • Jesus never took captives; never killed anyone.
• Muhammad encouraged his men to rape enslaved women. (Abu Dawud 2150, Qur’an 4:24) • Jesus never encouraged rape; never enslaved women.
• Muhammad was never tortured, but tortured others. (Muslim 4131, Ibn Ishaq 436, 595, 734, 764) • Jesus suffered torture, but never tortured anyone. (Isaiah 53)
• Muhammad said: “And fight them until there is no more persecution and religion is only for Allah.” (Qur’an 8:39) • Jesus said: "Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you.” (Matthew 5:44)
• Muhammad ordered a slave to build the very pulpit from which he preached Islam. (Bukhari 47:743) • Jesus washed His disciples feet. (John 13:5)
• Muhammad demanded the protection of armed bodyguards, even in a house of worship. (Qur’an 4:102) • Jesus chastised anyone attempting to defend Him with force. (John 18:10-12)
• Muhammad advocated crucifying others. (Qur’an 5:33, Muslim 16:4131) • Jesus was crucified Himself, and forgave those who killed Him. (Luke 23:34)

• According to his followers, Muhammad had others give their lives for him. (Sahih Muslim 4413) • Jesus gave His life for others and their sins. (John 18:11 & Isaiah 53

Corrections in Early Qurʾān Manuscripts
http://library.lol/main/F9064CF5181C229BB50E2B7874AF5354

Answering Islam: The Crescent in Light of the Cross
https://3lib.net/book/739232/50b477?dsource=recommend

Evidence that the God of the Christians exists (For Mustafa Speaks and The Perfect Dawah)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcMsCUA3c7c

Theological and historical errors in the Qur'an:
Mary was not part of the Christian trinity!
https://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-bible-koran-errors-catholic-mariolatry-trinity-father-son-mary.htm

Christian Prince Debates
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbUF9A1EyENdfhH0IfnDoBQ/videos

Allah, the Best Deceiver (Qur'an 3:52)
The Qur'an openly states many times that Allah is the 'best deceiver'. The root word used in these verses is Makr which means deception.
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Allah,_the_Best_Deceiver_(Qur%27an_3:52)


The Muslim Allah is not the same god of the Bible! The God of the Bible loves everybody. Muslim's Allah does not! In the Quran it makes no sense for Allah to enter his creation because Allah's justice, mercy, and love are limited. The God of the bible, creator of all things, is not limited!
Allah of the Quran does not love those who exceed the limits. Qur'an 2:190
Allah of the Muslims does not love those who are ungrateful sinners. Quran 2:276
Allah of the Muslims does NOT love the unbelievers. Quran 3:32
Allah of the Muslims does not love the unjust. Quran 3:57
Allah of the Muslims does not love those who are proud, boastful. Quran 4:36
Allah of the Muslims does not love the extravagant. 7:31
Allah of the Muslims does not love the mischief makers 28:77
Allah only loves good Muslims who will follow his commands! He does not love rebellious sinners, or the unbelievers! So, would a god of the Quran enter the world to die for the sinners? NO! Christ died for the ungodly!
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God gave many signs through Moses, from giving water from a rock to parting the Red Sea. Jesus gave many signs also, beginning with water from wine, even including raising Lazarus from the dead, and Himself having risen from the dead. What signs are there from Mohammed?

About Muhammad's first revelation when the archangel Gabriel visited him.
There were no witnesses to the visit and nothing to verify that it actually took place at all.. outside of the word of Muhammad.

Fair enough, so far, right? My questions are:

(1) Without falling under the definition for blind faith, explain why we should trust that Muhammad did not simply lie about it?

(2) In order for something to be reasonable or rational it must contain a tenable foundation; that is, it must be debatable or able to be defended rationally. Without falling under the definition for blind faith, how can you possibly defend Muhammad's vision? I mean, there is no reasoning, no witnesses, no evidence at all to at least make it a little bit tenable. It cannot be rationally defended.

Some of the rulings on apostasy and apostates
The apostate is not to be put to death immediately after he falls into apostasy, especially if his apostasy happens because of some doubt that arose. Rather he should be asked to repent and he should be offered the opportunity to return to Islam and resolve his doubts, if he has any doubts. Then if he persists in his apostasy after that, he is to be put to death.
https://islamqa.info/en/answers/14231/some-of-the-rulings-on-apostasy-and-apostates


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Islam is incoherent T5tYLM9


Christianity vs Islam

Since the Muslim religion is contradictory to other religions; not all can be true and coherent at the same time and instance. This is a violation of the law of non-contradiction; A cannot be non-A. This egalitarianism that you seek in religious honor is different from the 14th amendment's equal treatment in regards to law. The tenets of Islam are incoherent when it comes to those of Christianity. Only a religion with a deity that is both absolute and personal can justify the tenets of reality. Islam does not have this sort of deity. Allah is described as 'beyond' knowing in the personal sense and is so abstract and absolute as it cannot be known; yet the Koran claims to 'know' this god! To have a coherent religion, such as the Christian one, we need a God that is the source of personal concern with the created order and absolute in nature at the same time. One that can be the source of immaterial entities such as absolute laws of logic, power to sustain the laws of nature for mankind's benefit, and a source of moral absolutes. Without all three of these, a religion is incoherent in its unity. In Islam there is the claim that Allah is all holy and cannot tolerate sin in his presence, yet there is no atonement for past sins. No one never knows if enough good works have been done. How can their holy god tolerate creatures in his presence that have no substitute atonement for their sins the way Christianity does? Only Christianity offers propitiation and atonement for sinful mankind through Christ's substituionary atonement. It is also the only religion with an absolute and personal God that offers coherence in its ideology.

the quran is a lie surah 4:82 if you find any lie in the quran, the whole quran is a lie
lie #1 surah 18:86 the sun sets in a muddy spring,
lie #2 surah 27:61 the earth is fixed and does not move,
lie#3 surah 81:1-2 the sun will be overthrown and the stars will fall
lie #4 surah 85:5-7 semen is created between the ribs and backbone.
lie #5 Sura 96:2 = man is created from a clot

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There are more than 100 verses in the Qur'an (Koran) advocating the use of violence to spread Islam.  There are exactly 123 verses in the Qur'an about killing and fighting.

Qur'an 9:5, known as "the verse of the sword," declares, "Fight and slay the pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem."

Better stay alone than to follow Mohammed. • Muhammad said: Allah hates those who don’t accept Islam. (Qur’an 30:4, 3:32, 22:38) • Jesus said: God loves everyone. (John
3:16) • Muhammad said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. (Muslim 1:33)  Jesus said: He who lives by the sword will die by the sword. (Matthew 26:52) • Muhammad stoned women for adultery. (Sahih Muslim 4206) • Jesus said: Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. (John 8:7) • Muhammad permitted stealing from unbelievers (Bukhan 44:668, Ibn Ishaq 764) • Jesus said: Thou shalt not steal (Matthew 19:18) • Muhammad permitted lying (Sahih Muslim 6303, Bukhari 49:857) • Jesus said: Thou shalt not bear false witness. (Matthew 19:18) • Muhammad owned and traded slaves (Sahih Muslim 3901) • Jesus neither owned nor traded slaves. • Muhammad murdered those who insulted him. (Bukhari 56:369, 4:241) • Jesus preached forgiveness and forgave those who killed Him. (Luke 23:34) • Muhammad said: If then anyone transgresses the prohibition against you, transgress ye likewise against him. (Qur’an 2:194) • Jesus said: If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. (Matthew 5:39) • Muhammad said: Jihad in the way of Allah elevates one’s position in Paradise by a hundred fold. (Muslim 4645) • Jesus said: Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. (Matthew 5:9) • Muhammad married 13 wives and kept sex slaves. (Bukhari 5:268, Qur’an 33:50) • Jesus was celibate, was never married. • Muhammad had sex with a 9 year old child. (Sahih Muslim 3309, Bukhari 58:236) • Jesus did not have sex with children. • Muhammad ordered the murder of women. (Ibn Ishaq 819, 995) • Jesus never harmed a woman, He loved and cared for them. • Muhammad said: O you who believe! Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness. (Qur’an 3:110) • Jesus said: Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the Earth. (Matthew 5:5) • Muhammad ordered 65 military campaigns and raids in his last 10 years. (Ibn Ishaq) • Jesus ordered no military campaigns, nor offered any approval of war or violence. • Muhammad killed captives taken in battle. (Ibn Ishaq 451) • Jesus never took captives; never killed anyone. • Muhammad encouraged his men to rape enslaved women. (Abu Dawud 2150, Qur’an 4:24) • Jesus never encouraged rape; never enslaved women. • Muhammad was never tortured, but tortured others. (Muslim 4131, Ibn Ishaq 436, 595, 734, 764) • Jesus suffered torture, but never tortured anyone. (Isaiah 53) • Muhammad said: “And fight them until there is no more persecution and religion is only for Allah.” (Qur’an 8:39) • Jesus said: "Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you.” (Matthew 5:44) • Muhammad ordered a slave to build the very pulpit from which he preached Islam. (Bukhari 47:743) • Jesus washed His disciples feet. (John 13:5) • Muhammad demanded the protection of armed bodyguards, even in a house of worship. (Qur’an 4:102) • Jesus chastised anyone attempting to defend Him with force. (John 18:10-12) • Muhammad advocated crucifying others. (Qur’an 5:33, Muslim 16:4131) • Jesus was crucified Himself, and forgave those who killed Him. (Luke 23:34) • According to his followers, Muhammad had others give their lives for him. (Sahih Muslim 4413) • Jesus gave His life for others and their sins. (John 18:11 & Isaiah 53)



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The curious thing about the Quran and Jesus is....
If what Jesus said is true, and what the Quran said about Jesus is true, then they are in conflict with each other.
According to the Quran, it says that Jesus is the Messiah, but not the Christ.
The problem here is that Messiah, and Christ are the same, in two different languages.
They both are "The Anointed One."

Thus, you have an inherent contradiction right off the bat.
Jesus said that he IS the way, the truth, and the life, and no one can come to the Father, except through Him.
So, either the Quran is true, or it's a lie.

Jesus said he is the Son of God, and the Quran says Allah has no son.
Jesus said several times before his crucifixion that he would be delivered to the religious leaders, and crucified, then die, and 3 days later, be raised from the dead.
The Quran says he didn't die.

This would claim that a people who were intimately acquainted with death, due to their experience with killing animals for their ritual sacrifices, and the commandments in the law didn't actually know what death was.
Moreover, it's saying that roman soldiers, also intimately acquainted with death, due to their own experience in killing, had no idea what death really was.
So, the problem I have is that a purported prophet who came along 600 years after the fact, claims that the people who were there, and actually killed Jesus, didn't know what they were doing, says they lied.
We then have the problem with Paul's letter to the Galatians, "if anyone, including an angel from heaven, preaches another gospel to you, let him be accursed by God."
Thus the claim that Gabriel tells Mary, and Joseph, and Daniel, that Jesus would be God's Savior, and his coming would be at a certain day, and then change all that...... by the Quran, 600 years later....
That's a serious contradiction.

Both can be lies, but both cannot be true.
As I recall, the Quran says that the prophets of God from the Bible spoke the truth, and should be listened to.
If that's the case, then their own words say that the Quran is built on lies, and contradicts the truth.
It strikes me that it's time for you to sit down and do a side by side study, and find out the truth.
The stories I'm hearing coming out of the middle east is that Jesus is showing up in dreams, and calling out a people who will follow him.
My prayer is that you actually want to know YHVH.
Jesus will introduce you to YHVH, when you follow Him.

According to Isaiah 1:18, YHVH says,
Come now, let us reason together. Though your sin be as scarlet, I will make it white as wool. Though it's red like crimson, I will make you white as snow.
According to chapter 30 vs 15, in Isaiah, YHVH says, in returning and in rest is your salvation. In quietness and confidence is your strength.
In chapter 32, YHVH says- the fruit of righteousness is peace, and confidence forever.
Does Allah forgive, and wipe away your sin?
Does he give you confidence, and peace forever?
YHVH, through faith in Jesus does.
Jesus says,

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

17 For God didn’t send his Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world should be saved through him.

18 He who believes in him is not judged. He who doesn’t believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God.

19 This is the judgment, that the light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the light; for their works were evil.

20 For everyone who does evil hates the light, and doesn’t come to the light, lest his works would be exposed.

21 But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his works may be revealed, that they have been done in God.”

Life, or death? YHVH offers life. As I've understood it, Allah only offers death.

Jesus says,
9 I am the door. If anyone enters in by me, he will be saved, and will go in and go out, and will find pasture.

10 The thief only comes to steal, kill, and destroy. I came that they may have life, and may have it abundantly.

11 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.


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Muhammad: A false prophet?

Prior to Islam, Mecca was home to a variety of gods. Meccans were polytheistic and worshipped 360 gods in the Kaabah, the large black cube which is the focus of Islamic prayer and worship today. As Muhammad began preaching his new monotheistic religion and declared all gods but Allah to be false, he and his followers began to suffer persecution at the hands of the polytheistic Meccans. In an attempt to placate the Meccans and buy some relief from persecution, Muhammad conveniently received a revelation acknowledging three Meccan female deities. These verses were originally recorded in Sura 53:19-22 as

Have you thought of al-Lat and al-Uzza and Manat, the third, the other; these are the exalted Gharaniq [cranes which fly at high altitude] whose intercession is approved.

Ibn Ishaq, Muhammad's earliest biographer, records; "When the Quraysh [Meccans] heard that, they were delighted and greatly pleased at the way i which he spoke of their gods, and they listened to him." Acknowledging the three Meccan deities accomplished what Muhammad had hoped for.

However, the angel Gabriel later revealed that Allah had not put those words in the mouth of Muhammad, but Satan had. Muhammad had spoken words given to him by Satan, which acknowledged other gods beside Allah. These verses have come to be know as the Satanic Verses.

The Implication

This presents a huge problem for Muhammad.

Muslims love to claim corruption of the Bible, and state that where the Qur'an and Bible agree, those portions of the Bible have not undergone corruption but rather remain reliable.

One such portion of scripture Muslims use, and thus consider uncorrupted, is Deuteronomy chapter 18. In particular, Musilms claim Deuteronomy 18:18 is a specific prophecy of Muhammad in the Old Testament (I will cover this argument in another article). If Muslims want to acknowledge verse 18 as reliable and uncorrupt, they must likewise accept verse 20, a mere two verses later and contained within the same paragraph. Deuteronomy 18:20 states:

But the prophet who dares to speak in My name a message I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods -- that prophet must die.

Here we have two criteria by which to identify a false prophet: one who attributes words to God that were not given by God, and one who speaks in the name of other gods.

Muhammad spoke in the name of other gods. He acknowledged al-Lat, al-Uzza, and Manat as three valid deities who deserved worhip and whose intercession could be sought.

Muhammad attributed words to God that God did not command him to speak. By his own admission, we find Muhammad stating, "I have fabricated things against God and have imputed to Him words which He has not spoken." (History of al-Tabari, vol. 6 p. 111, Albany, NY, SUNY Press)

Muslim apologists will point out that Muhammad received another revelation absolving him of this minor indiscretion:

Never have We sent a Rasool or a Prophet before you, O Muhammad, in whose reciting of the Revelations shaitan [Satan] did not threw in some falsehood; but Allah abolishes that which shaitan throws in and confirms His own Revelations, for Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise.

In other words, don’t worry Muhammad; all other prophets before you occasionally said things attributed to Satan and thought they were likewise from God, but God always corrected them. Of course, this is a groundless claim without merit, and in fact contrary to Deuteronomy 18:20.

According to Deuteronomy 18:20, Muhammad is a false prophet and must die. Of course, he is already dead, but the fact remains that over one billion people today still consider Muhammad to be a legitimate prophet. This is a tragedy.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/articles/jesus-muhammad.aspx

600 years after Christianity, Muhammad plagiarized and distorted the bible. When it was presented and rejected by the Jews, he then presented it to the Christians with the same result. In his anger for being rejected, he then plagiarized the satanic verses from the talmud to slam the infidels. These are some of the satanic verses found in the Jewish talmud.
* “The ‘goyim’ are not humans. They are beasts.” (Baba Mezia 114b)
* “If you eat with a ‘goy’ it is the same as eating with a dog.” (Tosapoth, Jebamoth 94b)
* “Even the best of the ‘goyim’ should all be killed.” (Soferim 15)
* “Sexual intercourse between the ‘goyim’ is like intercourse between animals.” (Sanhedrin 74b)
* “When it comes to a Gentile in peace times, one may harm him indirectly, for instance, by removing a ladder after he had fallen into a crevice.” (Shulkan Arukh, Yoreh De ‘ah, 158, Hebrew Edition only) * *“‘Yashu’ (derogatory for ‘Jesus’) is in Hell being boiled in hot excrement.” (Gittin 57a)
*[’Yashu’ is an acronym for the Jewish curse, ‘May his (Jesus) name be wiped out forevermore.’]
* Yashu (Jesus) was sexually immoral and worshipped a brick.” (Sanhedrin 107b)
* “Yashu (Jesus) was cut off from the Jewish people for his wickedness and refused to repent.” (Sotah 47a)
* “Miriam the hairdresser had sex with many men.” (Shabbath 104b, Hebrew Edition only)
* “She who was the descendant of princes and governors (the virgin Mary) played the harlot with carpenters.” (Sanhedrin 106a)
* “Christians who reject the Talmud will go to hell and be punished there for all generations.” (Rosh Hashanah 17a) All Mohammad did was replace Goy (gentile), or Christian to infidel and made a complete list of 106 of the quran's curses, from the Jewish talmudic curses. There is nothing original in the quran. It's all counterfeit.

Muhammad: A false prophet?

Prior to Islam, Mecca was home to a variety of gods. Meccans were polytheistic and worshipped 360 gods in the Kaabah, the large black cube which is the focus of Islamic prayer and worship today. As Muhammad began preaching his new monotheistic religion and declared all gods but Allah to be false, he and his followers began to suffer persecution at the hands of the polytheistic Meccans. In an attempt to placate the Meccans and buy some relief from persecution, Muhammad conveniently received a revelation acknowledging three Meccan female deities. These verses were originally recorded in Sura 53:19-22 as

Have you thought of al-Lat and al-Uzza and Manat, the third, the other; these are the exalted Gharaniq [cranes which fly at high altitude] whose intercession is approved.

Ibn Ishaq, Muhammad's earliest biographer, records; "When the Quraysh [Meccans] heard that, they were delighted and greatly pleased at the way i which he spoke of their gods, and they listened to him." Acknowledging the three Meccan deities accomplished what Muhammad had hoped for.

However, the angel Gabriel later revealed that Allah had not put those words in the mouth of Muhammad, but Satan had. Muhammad had spoken words given to him by Satan, which acknowledged other gods beside Allah. These verses have come to be know as the Satanic Verses.

The Implication

This presents a huge problem for Muhammad.

Muslims love to claim corruption of the Bible, and state that where the Qur'an and Bible agree, those portions of the Bible have not undergone corruption but rather remain reliable.

One such portion of scripture Muslims use, and thus consider uncorrupted, is Deuteronomy chapter 18. In particular, Musilms claim Deuteronomy 18:18 is a specific prophecy of Muhammad in the Old Testament (I will cover this argument in another article). If Muslims want to acknowledge verse 18 as reliable and uncorrupt, they must likewise accept verse 20, a mere two verses later and contained within the same paragraph. Deuteronomy 18:20 states:

But the prophet who dares to speak in My name a message I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods -- that prophet must die.

Here we have two criteria by which to identify a false prophet: one who attributes words to God that were not given by God, and one who speaks in the name of other gods.

Muhammad spoke in the name of other gods. He acknowledged al-Lat, al-Uzza, and Manat as three valid deities who deserved worhip and whose intercession could be sought.

Muhammad attributed words to God that God did not command him to speak. By his own admission, we find Muhammad stating, "I have fabricated things against God and have imputed to Him words which He has not spoken." (History of al-Tabari, vol. 6 p. 111, Albany, NY, SUNY Press)

Muslim apologists will point out that Muhammad received another revelation absolving him of this minor indiscretion:

Never have We sent a Rasool or a Prophet before you, O Muhammad, in whose reciting of the Revelations shaitan [Satan] did not threw in some falsehood; but Allah abolishes that which shaitan throws in and confirms His own Revelations, for Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise.

In other words, don’t worry Muhammad; all other prophets before you occasionally said things attributed to Satan and thought they were likewise from God, but God always corrected them. Of course, this is a groundless claim without merit, and in fact contrary to Deuteronomy 18:20.

According to Deuteronomy 18:20, Muhammad is a false prophet and must die. Of course, he is already dead, but the fact remains that over one billion people today still consider Muhammad to be a legitimate prophet. This is a tragedy.

The Trinity explained:
The following is found in Nabeel Qureshi's book, "Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus, Chapter 33, Resonating With The Trinity."

"Projected in the front of the (class)room were three large depictions of nitrate in bold black and white. We were studying resonance, the configuration of electrons in certain molecules. The basic concept of resonance is easy enough to understand, even without a background in chemistry. Essentially, the building block of every physical object is an atom, a positively charged nucleus orbited by tiny, negatively charged electrons. Atoms bond to one another by sharing their electrons, forming a molecule. Different arrangements of the electrons in certain molecules are called 'resonance structures.' Some molecules, like water, have no resonance while others have three resonance structures or more, like the nitrate on the board.

Although the concept was easy enough to grasp, the reality proved to be baffling. Mrs. Adamski concluded her lesson by commenting, 'These drawings are just the best way to represent resonance structures on paper, but it's actually much more complicated. Technically, a molecule with resonance is every one of its structures at any point in time.'

The rest of the class must have had the same expressions on their faces as I did because Mrs. Adamski repeated herself. 'It's all the structures all the time, never just one of them.'"

This was Nabeel's "come to Jesus moment" when his mind first opened up to understanding the Trinity One God of the Bible.

Has the Trinity One God of the Bible become better understood to you? It has to me!

PS - This book and its sequel, "No God But One, Allah or Jesus," are two of the best apologetic books I have ever read that help explain in clear Biblical arguments who the One God of the Bible is, and why we can confidently believe and know that He is the true GOD WHO IS.

======================================================================================================================

Islam is not a religion. It is a political ideology, disguised as a religion. 600 years after Christianity, Muhammad plagiarized and distorted the bible. When it was presented and rejected by the Jews, he then presented it to the Christians with the same result. In his anger for being rejected, he then plagiarized the satanic verses from the talmud to slam the infidels. These are some of the satanic verses found in the Jewish talmud.
* “The ‘goyim’ are not humans. They are beasts.” (Baba Mezia 114b)
* “If you eat with a ‘goy’ it is the same as eating with a dog.” (Tosapoth, Jebamoth 94b)
* “Even the best of the ‘goyim’ should all be killed.” (Soferim 15)
* “Sexual intercourse between the ‘goyim’ is like intercourse between animals.” (Sanhedrin 74b)
* “When it comes to a Gentile in peace times, one may harm him indirectly, for instance, by removing a ladder after he had fallen into a crevice.” (Shulkan Arukh, Yoreh De ‘ah, 158, Hebrew Edition only) * *“‘Yashu’ (derogatory for ‘Jesus’) is in Hell being boiled in hot excrement.” (Gittin 57a)
*[’Yashu’ is an acronym for the Jewish curse, ‘May his (Jesus) name be wiped out forevermore.’]
* Yashu (Jesus) was sexually immoral and worshipped a brick.” (Sanhedrin 107b)
* “Yashu (Jesus) was cut off from the Jewish people for his wickedness and refused to repent.” (Sotah 47a)
* “Miriam the hairdresser had sex with many men.” (Shabbath 104b, Hebrew Edition only)
* “She who was the descendant of princes and governors (the virgin Mary) played the harlot with carpenters.” (Sanhedrin 106a)
* “Christians who reject the Talmud will go to hell and be punished there for all generations.” (Rosh Hashanah 17a) All Mohammad did was replace Goy (gentile), or Christian to infidel and made a complete list of 106 of the quran's curses, from the Jewish talmudic curses. There is nothing original in the quran. It's all counterfeit.

============================================================================================================================================

Why Should there be a Sex Market(Brothel) in Paradise?
Why a Market just for Sexual pressures?
__
Sahih Bukhari Vol. 4, p. 172, No. 34
Ali reported that the Apostle of Allah said, "There is in Paradise a market wherein there will be no buying or selling, but will consist of MEN and WOMEN. When a ---MAN--- DESIRES a beauty, he WILL HAVE INTERCOURSE WITH THEM."

Jami-Al-Tirmidhi Sunna 2573 "also Known as the "Hour of Sex.."
Al-Tirmidhi HadithHadith 5646 Narrated byAli ibn AbuTalib
Allah's Messenger said, "In Paradise there is a market in which there is no buying or selling, but only the forms of men and women; and when a man desires a form he enters it."
See Also Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 54, Number 466, 
Sahih Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 402, Muslim 40:6804, 6805
Muslim 40:679


Islam is incoherent Ol2aHBY



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBGK-8fjpHM



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2Islam is incoherent Empty Jesus vs Muhammed Thu Jan 15, 2015 2:17 pm

Otangelo


Admin

Jesus vs Muhammed

https://reasonandscience.catsboard.com/t1910-islam-is-a-lie#3213

Better stay alone than to follow Mohammed. • Muhammad said: Allah hates those who don’t accept Islam. (Qur’an 30:4, 3:32, 22:38) • Jesus said: God loves everyone. (John
3:16) • Muhammad said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. (Muslim 1:33)  Jesus said: He who lives by the sword will die by the sword. (Matthew 26:52) • Muhammad stoned women for adultery. (Sahih Muslim 4206) • Jesus said: Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. (John 8:7) • Muhammad permitted stealing from unbelievers (Bukhan 44:668, Ibn Ishaq 764) • Jesus said: Thou shalt not steal (Matthew 19:18) • Muhammad permitted lying (Sahih Muslim 6303, Bukhari 49:857) • Jesus said: Thou shalt not bear false witness. (Matthew 19:18) • Muhammad owned and traded slaves (Sahih Muslim 3901) • Jesus neither owned nor traded slaves. • Muhammad murdered those who insulted him. (Bukhari 56:369, 4:241) • Jesus preached forgiveness and forgave those who killed Him. (Luke 23:34) • Muhammad said: If then anyone transgresses the prohibition against you, transgress ye likewise against him. (Qur’an 2:194) • Jesus said: If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. (Matthew 5:39) • Muhammad said: Jihad in the way of Allah elevates one’s position in Paradise by a hundred fold. (Muslim 4645) • Jesus said: Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. (Matthew 5:9) • Muhammad married 13 wives and kept sex slaves. (Bukhari 5:268, Qur’an 33:50) • Jesus was celibate, was never married. • Muhammad had sex with a 9 year old child. (Sahih Muslim 3309, Bukhari 58:236) • Jesus did not have sex with children. • Muhammad ordered the murder of women. (Ibn Ishaq 819, 995) • Jesus never harmed a woman, He loved and cared for them. • Muhammad said: O you who believe! Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness. (Qur’an 3:110) • Jesus said: Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the Earth. (Matthew 5:5) • Muhammad ordered 65 military campaigns and raids in his last 10 years. (Ibn Ishaq) • Jesus ordered no military campaigns, nor offered any approval of war or violence. • Muhammad killed captives taken in battle. (Ibn Ishaq 451) • Jesus never took captives; never killed anyone. • Muhammad encouraged his men to rape enslaved women. (Abu Dawud 2150, Qur’an 4:24) • Jesus never encouraged rape; never enslaved women. • Muhammad was never tortured, but tortured others. (Muslim 4131, Ibn Ishaq 436, 595, 734, 764) • Jesus suffered torture, but never tortured anyone. (Isaiah 53) • Muhammad said: “And fight them until there is no more persecution and religion is only for Allah.” (Qur’an 8:39) • Jesus said: "Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you.” (Matthew 5:44) • Muhammad ordered a slave to build the very pulpit from which he preached Islam. (Bukhari 47:743) • Jesus washed His disciples feet. (John 13:5) • Muhammad demanded the protection of armed bodyguards, even in a house of worship. (Qur’an 4:102) • Jesus chastised anyone attempting to defend Him with force. (John 18:10-12) • Muhammad advocated crucifying others. (Qur’an 5:33, Muslim 16:4131) • Jesus was crucified Himself, and forgave those who killed Him. (Luke 23:34) • According to his followers, Muhammad had others give their lives for him. (Sahih Muslim 4413) • Jesus gave His life for others and their sins. (John 18:11 & Isaiah 53)



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3Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Thu Jan 15, 2015 2:17 pm

Otangelo


Admin

It has been proven that Islam, and the Quran, are a fabrication of the late seventh century, at least 70 years after Muhammed died. No manuscript of Uthman exists. The first mosks where facing Petra, not Mecca. The Quran has over two thousand divergencies, it HAS changed and evolved over time. Watch this video, search for the truth. Educate yourself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zd9lIuUjPs0

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4Islam is incoherent Empty The Variations Between the Codices Sat Jan 17, 2015 5:45 pm

Otangelo


Admin

The Variations Between the Codices

http://www.debate.org.uk/debate-topics/historical/does-the-bible/#I3

Arthur Jeffery in his book points out several thousand variants taken from over thirty “main sources.” Of special note are those which he found between the codex of Ibn Mas’ud and that of Zaid ibn Thabit. He also found that Mas’ud’s codex agreed with the other codices which existed at the expense of Zaid’s text (while we don’t have the time to go into all the variations, it might be helpful if you could obtain a copy of Arthur Jeffrey’s book: Materials for the history of the Text of the Qur’an).
According to Jeffery, Abu Mas’ud’s Codex was different from the Uthmanic text in several different ways:
It did not contain the Fatiha (the opening sura, sura 1), nor the two charm suras (suras 113 and 114).
It contained different vowels within the same consonantal text (Jeffery 25-113).
It contained Shi’ite readings (i.e. suras 5:67; 24:35; 26:215; 33:25,33,56; 42:23; 47:29; 56:10; 59:7; 60:3; 75:17-19) (Jeffery 40,65,68).
Entire phrases were different, such as:
sura 3:19: Mas’ud has “The way of the Hanifs” instead of “Behold, the [true] religion (din) of God is Islam.”
sura 3:39: Mas’ud has “Then Gabriel called to him, ‘O Zachariah’”, instead of the Uthmanic reading: “Then the angels called to him as he stood praying in the sanctuary.”
Only his codice begins sura 9 with the Bismilah, while the Uthmanic text does not (“bismi ‘llahi ‘l-rahmani ‘l-rahim” meaning, “In the name of God, the Merciful, the Compassionate”).
Finally, the order of the suras in Ibn Mas’ud’s codex is different from the Uthmanic text in that Mas’ud’s list arranges the suras more closely in order of descending length.

G5ii: Ubayy Ka’b's Codex

Ubayy Ka’b's codex also had variations. Though there are those who disagree, it seems to have been less important than Ibn Mas’ud’s, as it was not the source of any secondary codices.
It included two suras not found in the Uthmanic or Ibn Mas’ud’s texts: the surat al-Khal’, with three verses, and surat al-Hafd, with six verses (Jeffery pg. 180ff). Al-Fadl b. Shadhan is said to have seen a copy of Ubayy’s 116 suras (rather than the 114 of Uthman’s) in a village near Basra in the middle of the 3rd century A.H. (10th century C.E.).
The order of suras in Ubayy’s codex is said to have differed from that of Uthman’s.
G6: Conclusions on the Collation of the Qur’anic Text

These variations in the codices show that the original text of the Qur’an cannot have been perfect. The fact that a little known secretary (Zaid ibn Thabit) was chosen as the final arbiter of the Qur’anic text points to possible political interference. The admission by this secretary that the task of collating the verses was unduly daunting and his consequent pronouncement that one verse was initially missing from his finished text (sura 33:23) while another verse, according to authoritative sources, is still missing (the stoning verse) puts even more suspicion on its authenticity.
On top of that, the many variations which exist between Zaid’s text and those of supposedly more authoritative collators (Mas’ud and Ka’b) can only add to the perception of many today that the Uthmanic Qur’an which we supposedly have today leaves us with more doubt than assurance for its authority as the perfect word of God.
Yet that is not all. We also know from Muslim tradition that the Uthmanic Qur’an had to be reviewed and amended to meet the Caliph’s standard for a single approved text even after Uthman’s death. This was carried out by al-Hajjaj, the governor of Kufa, who made eleven distinct amendments and corrections to the text, which were later reduced to seven readings.
If the other codices were in existence today, one could compare the one with the other to ascertain which could claim to be closest to the original. Even Hafsah’s copy, the original from which the final text was taken, was later destroyed by Mirwan, the governor of Medina. But for what reason???
Does this act not intimate that there were problems between the other copies, possibly glaring contradictions, which needed to be thrown out? Can we really believe that the rest were destroyed simply because Uthman wished to have only one manuscript which conformed to the Quraishi dialect (if indeed such a dialect existed)? Why then burn the other codices? If, as some contend today, the other codices were only personal reminisces of the writers, then why did the prophet give those codices so much authority during his lifetime? Furthermore, how could Uthman claim to judge one from the other now that Muhammad was no longer around?
There are certain scholars today who believe that Zaid ibn Thabit and his co-workers could have reworked the Arabic, so as to make the text literately sophisticated and thus seemingly superior to other Arabic works of its time; and thus create the claim that this was indeed the illiterate Muhammad’s one miracle.
There are others, such as John Wansbrough from SOAS, who go even further, contending that all of the accounts about companion codices and individual variants were fabricated by later Muslim jurists and philologers. He asserts that the collection stories and the accounts of the companion codices arose in order to give an ancient authority to a text that was not even compiled until the 9th century or later.
He feels that the text of the Qur’an was so fluid that the multiple accounts (i.e. of the punishment stories) represent “variant traditions” of different metropolitan centres (such as Kufa, Basra, Medina etc.), and that as late as the 9th century a consonantal textus receptus ne varietur still had not been achieved. Today, his work is taking on greater authority within scholarly circles.
Unfortunately we will never know the real story, because the originals (if indeed they ever existed) which could have told us so much were destroyed. All we have are the copies written years after the originals by those who were then ordered to destroy their originals. There are, therefore, no manuscripts to compare with to give the current Qur’an authenticity, as we have with the Bible.
For those who may wonder why this is so important, let me provide an example: If after I had read this paper out-loud, everyone was to then write down all I had said from memory when they returned home, there would certainly be a number of variations. But we could find out these variations by putting them all together and comparing the many copies one against the other, as the same errors would not be written at the same place by everyone. The final result would be a rendering which is pretty close to what I had said originally. But if we destroyed all of the copies except one, there would be no means of comparing, and all precision would be lost. Our only hope would be that the one which remained was as close to what I had said as possible. Yet we would have no other rendering or example to really know for sure.
Consequently, the greater number of copies preserved, the more certitude we would have of the original text. The Qur’an has only one doctored manuscript to go on, while the New Testament has over 24,000 manuscripts in existence, from a variety of backgrounds, from which to compare!!! Can you see the difference?!
It is therefore quite clear that that which is known as the Textus Receptus of the Qur’an (the text considered authoritative in the Muslim world today) cannot lay claim to be the Textus Originalis (the genuine original text).
The current Qur’anic text which is read throughout the Muslim world is merely Zaid’s version, duly corrected where necessary, and later amended by al-Hajjaj. Consequently, the ‘official’ text as it currently stands was only arrived at through an extended process of amendments, recensions, eliminations and an imposed standardization of a preferred text at the initiative of one caliph, and not by a prophetic direction of divine decree.
In conclusion one can safely say that there is relative authenticity of the text in the sense that it adequately retains the gist and content of what was originally there. There is, however, no evidence to support the cherished Muslim hypothesis that the Qur’an has been preserved absolutely intact to the last dot and letter, as so many Muslims claim (For further reading see Jam’ al-Qur’an, by Gilchrist).
Yet, even if we were to let the issue rest, concerning whether or not the Qur’an which we have now is the same as that which Muhammad related to his followers, we would still need to ask whether its authority might not be impinged upon due to the numerous errors and contradictions which can be found within its pages. It is to that question that we now proceed.

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5Islam is incoherent Empty The real Quran Thu Nov 19, 2015 6:30 am

serdar akkaya



Admin wrote:the quran is a lie surah 4:82 if you find any lie in the quran, the whole quran is a lie
lie #1 surah 18:86 the sun sets in a muddy spring,
lie #2 surah 27:61 the earth is fixed and does not move,
lie#3 surah 81:1-2 the sun will be overthrown and the stars will fall
lie #4 surah 85:5-7 semen is created between the ribs and backbone.
lie #5 Sura 96:2 = man is created from a clot

http://www.islamlies.com/

There are more than 100 verses in the Qur'an (Koran) advocating the use of violence to spread Islam.  There are exactly 123 verses in the Qur'an about killing and fighting.

Qur'an 9:5, known as "the verse of the sword," declares, "Fight and slay the pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem."

THERE ARE 6662 VERSES IN QURAN AND AROUND 100 VERSES ARE ABOUT THE HOT WAR VERSES. IN THE BEGINNING OF ISLAMIC HISTORY MUSLIMS WERE NOT GIVEN PERMISSION TO FIGHT BACK WHEN THEY ARE UNDER ATTACK. THEN GOD ALLOWED THEM TO FIGHT BACK AND HAPPENED 3 QUITE BIG WARS BETWEEN BELIEVERS AND NON BELIEVERS; THOSE VERSES ARE ABOUT THOSE 3 WAR 100 OUT OF 6662 WHICH IS ABOUT 1,5 % . ALL WAR VERSES ARE EITHER SURA NUMBER 3 OR 9 DURING THE TIME WHEN THE WARS TOOK PLACE

6Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Sun Nov 22, 2015 5:40 am

Otangelo


Admin

See quote below from the noted Islamic jurist, A.K. Brohi (Malik, S. K. ‘The Quranic Concept of War’. Lahore: Wajidalis, 1979. xix.). With respect to the Bataclan concert goers, I'm not defending the Muslims. I do think, however, that to openly mock God is to put him to the test, and that is not a position I would want to be in.

"Islam views the world as though it were bipolarised in two opposing camps--Darus-Salam facing Darul-Harb--the first one is submissive to the Lord in co-operating with God's purpose to establish peace, order and such other pre-conditions of human development, but the second one, on the other hand, is engaged in perpetuating defiance of the same Lord. Such a state of affairs which engages any one in rebellion against God's will is termed as 'Fitna'--which literally means test or trial. The term 'Fitna' refers us to misconduct on the part of a man who establishes his own norms and expects obedience from others, thereby usurping God's authority--who alone is sovereign. 

In Sura Infa'al Chapter 8 Verse 39, it is said
'And fight on until there remains no more tumult or oppression and they remain submissive only to God.'


To the same effect are the words used in Sura Toba Verse 9, 
'Fight those who believe not in the Lord, nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which has been forbidden by His messenger and His apostle nor acknowledge the religion of truth (even if they are) of the people of the book [Jews & Christians], until they pay Jazya with willing submission and feel themselves subdued.'"

"Many Western Scholars have pointed their accusing fingers at some of the above verses in the Quran to be able to contend that the world of Islam is in a state of perpetual struggle against the non-Muslims. As to them, it is a sufficient answer to make, if one were to point out, that the defiance of God's authority by one who is His slave exposes that slave to the risk of being held guilty of treason and such a one, in the perspective of Islamic law, is indeed to be treated as a sort of that cancerous growth on that organism of humanity, which has been created 'Kanafsin Wahidatin' that is, like one, single, indivisible self.
 It thus becomes necessary to remove the cancerous mal-formation even if it be by surgical means (if it would not respond to other treatment), in order to save the rest of Humanity."

1- Theres is no such meaning in those verses(30:4, 3:32, 22:38); not even close ; there is no such meaning like Allah hates those who dont accept Islam ; Allah hates non believers 2- Muslim 1:33 is fake Hadith ; this is contrary to the entire logic of Quran 3- there is no stoning for adultery in Islam ; https://www.facebook.com/1618153118472847/videos/vb.1618153118472847/1637386359882856/?type=2&theater 4- Fake hadith ; stealing is prohibited from all people in Quran ; there is no limitation like believers or non believers
I will not answer for your claims about the Hadiths because they are all fake ; Prophet Muhammed did never say or did any of them mentioned in those wrong Hadiths; one of the reasons of this page is to clean Islamic word from those fake hadiths and misunderstanding depending on those wrong Hadiths ;for the claims about Quranic verses ;(2,194) Muslim people have right to fight back if they were attacked before .We can not start a war but we can counterattack if we are under attack; which is completely compliance with today's international law. I believe Jesus meant it for your brother in your religion ; not some unbelievers attacking you and killing you .
( 4:24 ) there is nothing to force women for sex in this verse; i think you should read verses on which you biased your claims ; the hadith is fake ;
4:102 it is another verse you are trying to deviate from the context meaning; it is a verse during war and when the time for praying comes ; muslims split into 2 and one group pray after another in sequence; Prophet fighted with non believers who attacked him alone in the battle ; God even told him in Quran to remove his shield because GOD was protecting him
5:33 is again a verse revealed during hot war time ; you have to check the context; verse before and after ; the text is about a war ; when Muslims confronted non believers whom first started the war and expelled Muslims from their houses and force them to immigrate to Madina
(8:39) this verse is limited by another verse; you have to preach the religion as much as you can according to this verse but you can not cross the limit of another verse ; WHICH IS   8:190 . Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. this verse says you can only attack when you are under attack ; you have no right to attack in any verse anywhere in Quran.



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7Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Wed Nov 25, 2015 2:48 am

serdar akkaya



Admin wrote:See quote below from the noted Islamic jurist, A.K. Brohi (Malik, S. K. ‘The Quranic Concept of War’. Lahore: Wajidalis, 1979. xix.). With respect to the Bataclan concert goers, I'm not defending the Muslims. I do think, however, that to openly mock God is to put him to the test, and that is not a position I would want to be in. 

"Islam views the world as though it were bipolarised in two opposing camps--Darus-Salam facing Darul-Harb--the first one is submissive to the Lord in co-operating with God's purpose to establish peace, order and such other pre-conditions of human development, but the second one, on the other hand, is engaged in perpetuating defiance of the same Lord. Such a state of affairs which engages any one in rebellion against God's will is termed as 'Fitna'--which literally means test or trial. The term 'Fitna' refers us to misconduct on the part of a man who establishes his own norms and expects obedience from others, thereby usurping God's authority--who alone is sovereign. In Sura Infa'al Chapter 8 Verse 39, it is said 'And fight on until there remains no more tumult or oppression and they remain submissive only to God.' To the same effect are the words used in Sura Toba Verse 9, 'Fight those who believe not in the Lord, nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which has been forbidden by His messenger and His apostle nor acknowledge the religion of truth (even if they are) of the people of the book [Jews & Christians], until they pay Jazya with willing submission and feel themselves subdued.'"

"Many Western Scholars have pointed their accusing fingers at some of the above verses in the Quran to be able to contend that the world of Islam is in a state of perpetual struggle against the non-Muslims. As to them it is a sufficient answer to make, if one were to point out, that the defiance of God's authority by one who is His slave exposes that slave to the risk of being held guilty of treason and such a one, in the perspective of Islamic law, is indeed to be treated as a sort of that cancerous growth on that organism of humanity, which has been created 'Kanafsin Wahidatin' that is, like one, single, indivisible self. It thus becomes necessary to remove the cancerous mal-formation even if it be by surgical means (if it would not respond to other treatment), in order to save the rest of Humanity."

1- ABOUT THE VERSE 8.39 ; THE PEOPLE MENTIONED TO FIGHT ABOUT IS ALREADY INDICATED 8.30 . Remember how the Unbelievers plotted against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They plot and plan, and Allah too plans; but the best of planners is Allah.
AS YOU CAN SEE; YOU CAN NOT DRAW ONE VERSE OUT OF CONTEXT AND MAKE COMMENTS ABOUT IT;YOU HAVE EVALUATE ALL THE WAR SURA TOGETHER IN WHICH THERE ARE ALOT OF PRECAUTIONS TO SHOW MERCY TO END THE WAR;  THOSE PEOPLE TO FIGHT ARE THE ONES THAT PLOTTED BELIEVERS  , SLAYED THEM  AND EXPELLED
THEM FORM THEIR HOUSES.
2- (2:190-193) Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.  But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practice oppression.


As we can understand from those verses; war can be declared against only those who declare war first. Moreover, Allah warns believers not to transgress the limits in this war. During the war, if the other party cease to fight and ask for mercy ; Muslims should obey this and cease the war as well. For the damage they get from war,  they ask for “Cizye”; this Arabic word is conjugated from the word Punishment in Arabic ; hence means “ War compensation” not the tax. War compensation is the proof for war is not for invasion in Quran. Because if the war were for invasion only ; the war compensation would not be demanded. The main aim for invasion is to gather the other people’s land; asking for the damage of the war would be meaningless. It is war compensation, which Savage Germany paid after World War 2.  Cizye, war compensation, exists in Civil Law as well.

3- There is no slavery in ISlam; the word slave exists only in one verse in entire Quran and it is under the condition that ; if a Muslim is mistaken ; he has to pay money to a slave owner to free his slave. By this Islam gradually ends the slavery; Muslims are not allowed to own slave at all

8Islam is incoherent Empty ANSWERS FROM QURAN Wed Nov 25, 2015 3:05 am

serdar akkaya



1- Theres is no such meaning in those verses(30:4, 3:32, 22:38); not even close ; there is no such meaning like Allah hates those who dont accept Islam ; Allah hates non believers 2- Muslim 1:33 is fake Hadith ; this is contrary to the entire logic of Quran 3- there is no stoning for adultery in Islam ; https://www.facebook.com/1618153118472847/videos/vb.1618153118472847/1637386359882856/?type=2&theater 4- Fake hadith ; stealing is prohibited from all people in Quran ; there is no limitation like believers or non believers
I will not answer for your claims about the Hadiths because they are all fake ; Prophet Muhammed did never say or did any of them mentioned in those wrong Hadiths; one of the reasons of this page is to clean Islamic word from those fake hadiths and misunderstanding depending on those wrong Hadiths ;for the claims about Quranic verses ;(2,194) Muslim people have right to fight back if they were attacked before .We can not start a war but we can counterattack if we are under attack; which is completely compliance with today's international law. I believe Jesus meant it for your brother in your religion ; not some unbelievers attacking you and killing you .
( 4:24 ) there is nothing to force women for sex in this verse; i think you should read verses on which you biased your claims ; the hadith is fake ;
4:102 it is another verse you are trying to deviate from the context meaning; it is a verse during war and when the time for praying comes ; muslims split into 2 and one group pray after another in sequence; Prophet fighted with non believers who attacked him alone in the battle ; God even told him in Quran to remove his shield because GOD was protecting him
5:33 is again a verse revealed during hot war time ; you have to check the context; verse before and after ; the text is about a war ; when Muslims confronted non believers whom first started the war and expelled Muslims from their houses and force them to immigrate to Madina
(8:39) this verse is limited by another verse; you have to preach the religion as much as you can according to this verse but you can not cross the limit of another verse ; WHICH IS   8:190 . Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. this verse says you can only attack when you are under attack ; you have no right to attack in any verse anywhere in Quran.

9Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:24 am

Otangelo


Admin

You will not convince anyone here about your religion. 

John 14:6

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

So the way to the father, and to heaven, is Jesus Christ alone. Not Islam, not muhammed, nor any other religion. Only Jesus Christ.

Islam is a disgrace for humanity.

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10Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Sun Nov 20, 2016 11:49 am

Otangelo


Admin

https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

http://www.foundalis.com/rlg/Quran_and_science.htm

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11Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Fri Dec 02, 2016 4:34 am

Otangelo


Admin

Islamic Invasion Of India: The Greatest Genocide In History

https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2015/08/31/islamic-invasion-of-india-the-greatest-genocide-in-history/

Muslim historian Firishta [full name Muhammad Qasim Hindu Shah, born in 1560 and died in 1620], the author of the Tarikh-i Firishta and the Gulshan-i Ibrahim, was the first to give an idea to the medieval bloodbath that was India during Muslim rule, when he declared that over 400 million Hindus got slaughtered during Muslim invasion and occupation of India. Survivors got enslaved and castrated. India’s population is said to have been around 600 million at the time of Muslim invasion. By the mid 1500’s the Hindu population was 200 million.

By the time the British arrived to the shores of India and after centuries of Islamic law ruling India, the Hindu population was not behaving like their normal self; they were behaving like Muslims. There are many witness reports from the British archives of horrendous Hindu incidents that were shocking in cruelty to the British – and they therefore sometimes referred to the people as “savages”. Yes, anyone who gets contaminated by the association with Islamic ‘culture’ truly gets tainted and savaged. That is exactly why it is so detrimental and dangerous.

Today, like other cultures with a soul massacred by Islam, India is not truly a Hindu nation. India is a shadow of Islam, a Hindufied version of Islam, where every human atrocity has been emulated and adopted into a culture previously alien to such brutality. And in association with it’s foreign mohamedan pest, these Islamic habits have become adopted and accepted as a “normal” part of Indian culture. But if we look at pre-Islamic Indian culture it was a in general a benevolent culture of knowledge and learning, much more so than it is today.

From the time of the Umayyad Dynasty (711AD) to  the last Mughal, Bahadur Shah Zafar (1858), so widely praised as great leaders by Indian historians themselves, entire cities were burnt down and the populations massacred, with hundreds of thousands killed in every campaign, and similar numbers deported as slaves. Every new invader made (often literally) his hills of Hindus skulls. Thus, the conquest of Afghanistan in the year 1000 was followed by the annihilation of the Hindu population; the region is still called the Hindu Kush, i.e. “Hindu slaughter.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Hindus

.



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12Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:06 pm

Otangelo


Admin

Does Allah Love Unbelievers?


One of Allah’s 99 Names is al-Waddud, “the Loving.” Allah is called al-Waddud twice in the Qur’an. In 11:90, the prophet Shu’aib tells the people of Midian, “Ask pardon, then, from your Lord, then turn to Him; verily, my Lord is merciful, loving!” Likewise, in 85:12-16 we read:
Lo! the punishment of thy Lord is stern. Lo! He it is Who produceth, then reproduceth, and He is the Forgiving, the Loving, Lord of the Throne of Glory, Doer of what He will.

Nevertheless, other passages in the Qur’an qualify Allah’s love significantly. While Allah is said to love those who do good deeds (2:195), those who are pure (2:222), those who are righteous (9:7), and those who fight in his cause (61:4), the Qur’an is equally clear that Allah has no love for transgressors (2:190), ungrateful sinners (2:276), the unjust (3:57), or the proud (4:36). Even more significantly, the Qur’an states that Allah does not love non-Muslims: 
Qur’an 3:31-32—Say [O Muhammad]: If you love Allah, then follow me, Allah will love you and forgive you your faults, and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. Say: Obey Allah and the Apostle; but if they turn back, then surely Allah does not love the unbelievers

Qur’an 30:43-45—Then turn thy face straight to the right religion before there come from Allah the day which cannot be averted; on that day they shall become separated. Whoever disbelieves, he shall be responsible for his disbelief, and whoever does good, they prepare (good) for their own souls, that He may reward those who believe and do good out of His grace; surely He does not love the unbelievers.

Notice that 3:31-32 makes Allah’s love contingent on whether a person believes in Muhammad. This is similar to what we find in 19:46, which declares: “Lo! those who believe and do good works, the Beneficent will appoint for them love.” 
Hence, although Allah is called “the Loving,” the Qur’an only means by this that Allah will love people once they believe in him and obey his prophet. The god of Islam has no love for sinners and unbelievers. 
Interestingly, the “Love me first and I’ll love you back” kind of love exhibited by Allah in the Qur’an is condemned by Jesus in Matthew 5:43-48: 

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? If you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.”



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13Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:45 am

Otangelo


Admin

Thats how forced conversions work in Islam. First you attack a group in a city,region, or country. Then you kill those who won't convert or pay a high tax. Then you suppress all other religious teachings and ban criticism of your "religion." Then you indoctrinate the children from birth and suppress all other teachings of religion or opposing ideologies. Then you set examples by doing violence, torturing and often killing critics or those who dare to leave your "religion" to intimidate those who try to think free thoughts. Similar tactics were used by every dictator in history, including Stalin, Mao and Hitler.

Jesus from the Quran is a false imaginary Jesus. Your prophet contradicted himself by saying that the Bible is the Word of God and that if the Quran contradicts the Bible then the older book should take precedence. The Old and New Testaments teach that the Messiah (Jesus Christ) would be God in human form, the New Testament teaches that Jesus was Crucified and Resurrected. This was in every legitimate Bible before, during and after your "prophet" lived. Therefore both Testaments being older than the Quran, means by your "prophets" own words they should take precedence over the new book you believe in. Also our top scholars easily win debates on the historical evidence for the Resurrection of Jesus!

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/articles/jesus-muhammad.aspx

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14Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Thu Feb 09, 2017 6:48 pm

Otangelo


Admin

Ask your Muslim friends:
- Is God eternal?
- Is God essentially love?
- Is God's love essentially characterized by self-giving to an Other?
If the Muslim answers yes to all of the above, then ask:
- Before or apart from creation, who is the object of God's love, if God is essentially love and God's love is essentially self-giving?
Admittedly, this is a more abstract argument than I would usually use. But if your Muslim interlocutor accepts the premises, this is a pretty good argument for there being more than one Person constituting the unique identity of the one God.

THE QURANIC DILEMMA
Why the Quran is NOT written by Allah?
Our Muslim friends are convinced that the Quran is the word of God inspired to Muhammad through the angel Gabriel.
However, a simple search through the Quran will reveal some contradictory information damaging to this fallacy.
One of those findings has to do with Allah himself declaring that he HIMSELF wrote in the Psalms (Zaboor), which is according to Islam is the Book of David. This claim can be found in Q21:105 as we can read below (also see attached image):
Q21:105
“Before this We wrote in the Psalms, after the Message (given to Moses): My servants the righteous, shall inherit the earth." Yousuf Ali
“And WE have already written in the Book of David, after the reminder, that MY righteous servants shall inherit the Land.” Sher Ali
“Walaqad katabna fee alzzaboori min baAAdi alththikri anna al-arda yarithuha AAibadiya alssalihoona” - Transliteration
It is obvious from this verse that Allah himself is declaring that he wrote the Psalm after the Zikr (or Remembrance, or the advice, which is the Torah). Making It very clear that Allah is the one who wrote these two books.
What is so astonishing though is that you will NOT find a single verse in the Quran where Allah stated that HE wrote the Quran!
Once again, this is another proof that the Quran is a man-made product written by mere men.
Our Simple question to our Muslim friends is this:
Why do you believe that Allah wrote the Quran, when in fact he never said so? Does not this serve as a proof to you that your book is written by humans; such as Uthman?



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15Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Tue May 18, 2021 8:57 am

Otangelo


Admin

Engaging Muslims Part 2: Five Common Objections
https://www.namb.net/apologetics/resource/engaging-muslims-part-2-five-common-objections/

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16Islam is incoherent Empty How the Quran got science wrong Sun May 23, 2021 7:26 am

Otangelo


Admin

How the Quran got science wrong

Sura 86:6-7 – Origin of semen between Backbone and Ribs


The Quran and embryology

Sura 86:6-7 – Origin of semen between Backbone and Ribs
“He was created from a fluid (ma’in), ejected, Emerging from between the backbone and the ribs.”

At first sight, the verse seems to suggest that the substance from which humans are created originates from the backbone. This was also a commonly held view during ancient times as it can be observed in the teaching of Hippocrates who described the origin of semen in the brain which subsequently descends through “the spine to the sex organs”;

Islam is incoherent Nutfah29

Due to the fact that this has been a very common criticism of the veracity of the Qur’an, Hamza Tzortzis does address this contention in his paper. The following is his response,

Islam is incoherent Nutfah30

The two keywords that need examination are “sulb” (translated as backbone) and “tara’ib” (translated as ribs). Beginning with “sulb”, Hamza’s defense of this word seems to be that it can also mean “the loins” and that “it is well known that the sperm and semen come from an area referred to as the loins.” There was no surprise in realizing that this too is an absurd assertion.

Misrepresenting the Meaning of “sulb”
Perhaps Hamza ought to have performed a lexical analysis on the word in question. Here are the relevant meanings given for “sulb” in Lane’s lexicon;

Islam is incoherent Nutfah33

The most accurate definition of this term is that of the backbone. However, does Hamza’s defense using the meaning of “loins” solve the problem for the Qur’an? Certainly not! What Hamza fails to realize or willfully ignores is that “the loins” as “a euphemism for genitalia or sex organs” is the product of the English language and Hamza provides no evidence to suggest that the same euphemism was maintained among the ancient Arabs. In contrast, the primary definition of loins is also provided in the lexicon as “the lumbar portion”. This can also be verified using the Oxford English Dictionary;

Islam is incoherent Nutfah34

The secondary, euphemistic meaning of loins, related to the private parts, is also explained in OED as well as the Online Etymology dictionary as follows.[5] (Note: the year of origin of this euphemism);

Islam is incoherent Nutfah35

Islam is incoherent Nutfah36

This euphemistic definition is explained as a secondary “biblical and poetic” metaphor for one’s private parts and one that originated only in the early 16th century. Thus, it is unreasonable for Hamza to assign a definition, which specifically arose in 16th century English, to an Arabic word used in the 7th century. Interestingly, Lane’s lexicon also provides an account for another metaphorical idea associated with “sulb” among the Arabs;

Islam is incoherent Nutfah37

The lexicon explains the metaphorical idea expressed in the sayings of the Arabs; the origin of which was due to the belief that “the sperma of the man is held to proceed from the “sulb”(i.e. backbone) of the man” and then proceeds to site the contested verse, 86:7 as an example.

The take home point for Hamza or any other apologist is that there is no evidence to suggest that the 16th century English euphemistic meaning of the word “loins” applies to the Arabic “sulb”. An analogy of Hamza’s claim is that of a person looking up the definition of the Arabic term “sa’eed (سعيد)” in a dictionary and finding its meaning as “happy, gay” etc. However, the person then incompetently concludes that the Arabic word “sa’eed (سعيد)” means “homosexual” due to the double meaning of the word “gay” in English. Hamza’s defense is equally ludicrous.

Thus, the realistic and rational definition of “sulb” in the context of the verse 86:7 is certainly that of the “backbone”. 2

The account of the different stages in embryology as described by the Qur'an, ar-Razi and al-Quff is identical to that taught by Galen, writing in around AD 150 in Pergamum (Bergama in modern Turkey).  there is not a single statement contained in the Qur'an relating to modern embryology that was not well known through direct observation by the ancient Greek and Indian physicians many centuries before the Qur'an was written. Morever, much of what the Qur'an actually does say about embryology is scientifically inaccurate. The ancient physicians' works were translated into Syriac in the century preceeding Muhammed, and were therefore accessible to non-Greek speakers. We know that one of the Companions of the Prophet was a doctor who trained at the very same medical school that the Greek translations were kept and taught at. We even know that at least one of the verses which describes embryology, sura 23:14 contains the words of another of Muhammed's companions. We are forced to conclude that, far from proving the alleged divine credentials of the Qur'an, its embryological statements actually provide further convincing evidence for its human origins.
http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Science/embryo.html

http://www.islamlies.com/
2. https://theislamissue.wordpress.com/2019/01/21/quran-866-7-semen-comes-from-between-backbone-and-ribs/

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17Islam is incoherent Empty God is the ultimate Wed Aug 04, 2021 2:14 pm

Otangelo


Admin

Embryology in the Qur'an
https://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Science/embryo.html

Scientific Errors in the Quran
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

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18Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Sun Sep 05, 2021 3:28 pm

Otangelo


Admin

The Quran reveals that fasting rituals of Ramzan are rooted in pre-Islamic pagan and Jewish practice
The holy month of Ramzan is practised by followers of Islam across the world. The ninth month of the Islamic calendar is characterised by fasting, praying and giving zakat or alms.
However, observing a month of fasting and abstinence is actually a pre-Islamic practice. In 622 CE, Prophet Muhammad institutionalised this fast through a passage in the Quran. In fact, the mention of fasting in the Quran refers to it as a pre-existing practice. This also indicates why there is a constant debate around its spelling – Ramzan, as it is known in India, versus the Arabic Ramadan, which has been gaining worldwide prominence in the 21st century. Ramadan literally means “intense heat”, indicative of the summer month to which it was originally ascribed. In the seventh century, after the adoption of the lunar Islamic calendar, the month keeps shifting all through the year. “People have suddenly begun to call it Ramadan, since that is the pronunciation of the word in the Quran,” said Delhi-based writer Rana Safvi in 2015. “But as a child, growing up in Lucknow, it was always called Ramzan. This is a completely new thing.”
https://scroll.in/article/962303/the-quran-reveals-that-fasting-rituals-of-ramzan-are-rooted-in-pre-islamic-pagan-and-jewish-practice

Why Quran is logically fallacious
https://scroll.in/article/962303/the-quran-reveals-that-fasting-rituals-of-ramzan-are-rooted-in-pre-islamic-pagan-and-jewish-practice

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19Islam is incoherent Empty Re: Islam is incoherent Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:10 pm

Otangelo


Admin

The strongest argument against Islam is the immorality endorsed by Allah, the Quran, ahadith and Muhammad. If the truth is eternal, and Allah’s word is the truth, then how can the following come from, or be endorsed or condoned by, a moral God? I’m not talking about subjective morality relative to “the times” or “the customs” of seventh century Arabia. I’m talking about the (allegedly) objective — and, therefore, timeless — morality of Allah, his scripture and his final regent on Earth, the Prophet Muhammad. Are the following really moral examples for the ages?

Deadly raids of caravans for camels, booty and hostages for ransom or sale as (sex) slaves.


Sex with his child wife, Aisha.

Sex with teen-aged wives and sex slaves (concubines). Wife, Hafsa, was 17 or 19 at marriage (born 605 or 607). Safiyah was 17, according to Al Tabari, Volume 39, page 185.

Assassination of critics and poets.

Beheading the men of Banu Qurayza and taking everybody else as slaves.

Slave trading.

Subjugation of women.

Subjugation of dhimmis.

Expanding the Islamic state through violent jihad

https://www.quora.com/What-are-the-strongest-arguments-against-Islam

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